IBIS Macromodel Task Group Meeting date: 21 Jun 2011 Members (asterisk for those attending): Agilent: Fangyi Rao * Radek Biernacki Ansoft: Chris Herrick Danil Kirsanov Ansys: Samuel Mertens * Dan Dvorscak Deepak Ramaswamy Jianhua Gu * Curtis Clark Arrow Electronics: Ian Dodd Cadence Design Systems: Terry Jernberg * Ambrish Varma Celsionix: Kellee Crisafulli Cisco Systems: * Mike LaBonte Stephen Scearce Ashwin Vasudevan Syed Huq Ericsson: Anders Ekholm IBM: * Greg Edlund Intel: Michael Mirmak LSI Logic: Wenyi Jin Mentor Graphics: * John Angulo Vladimir Dmitriev-Zdorov Zhen Mu * Arpad Muranyi Micron Technology: Randy Wolff NetLogic Microsystems: Ryan Couts Nokia-Siemens Networks: * Eckhard Lenski Sigrity: Brad Brim Kumar Keshavan * Ken Willis SiSoft: Walter Katz Mike Steinberger * Todd Westerhoff Doug Burns Snowbush IP: Marcus Van Ierssel ST Micro: Syed Sadeghi Teraspeed Consulting Group: Scott McMorrow * Bob Ross TI: Casey Morrison Alfred Chong Vitesse Semiconductor: Eric Sweetman Xilinx: Mustansir Fanaswalla The meeting was lead by Arpad Muranyi ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Opens: - Bob: I have a BIRD to establish that Reserved_Parameters must be the first branch in AMI file - This is because the version number is there - Radek: Does Version also need to first within it? - Bob: That is already specified. - Radek: This seems straightforward - There were no objections - Arpad: Michael Mirmak caught a typo in the Type_Format_Table BIRD -------------------------- Call for patent disclosure: - None ------------- Review of ARs: Arpad: Submit Add Boolean to BNF BIRD draft to open forum - Done Ambrish: Submit Type and Format BIRD draft to open forum - Arpad did this - A problem was found and corrected by Ambrish - No objection Arpad: Send email to editorial committee - Done All: Comment on Corner typ/slow/fast association to typ/min/max Walter: Send email from Mike Steinberger to Ambrish answering his question: Are these maximum values for the model? - Not done? ------------- New Discussion: Arpad showed the AMI_parameter BIRD draft: - Radek: "information and parameters" are redundant - Arpad: What does "dynamic" refer to? - Todd: It may not be present in every call - Radek: It would be better without "dynamic" - Todd: Agree - Arpad: I will make these changes - Radek: The 3.1.2.6 title could be expanded out - Mike: Agree - Arpad: I will change that too - Todd motioned to vote with changes by acclamation - No objections AR: Arpad submit AMI_parameter BIRD to open forum Arpad showed Bob's BIRD draft: - Bob: Notes are added to highlight version to version changes - Minor changes in the analysis section - Todd: Does this clear up the keywords the parser gets wrong? - For example Tx_DCD - You have to say (Format (Corner, not just (Corner - Arpad: Curtis commented about "is presented" (should be "are") - That sentence could use a rewrite anyway - Todd: The new wording just added is much better - Arpad motioned to vote with changes - Greg seconded - No objections AR: Arpad submit Bob's BIRD to open forum Arpad: Where does the Corner Range BIRD stand? - Bob: Tools may have specific methods to deal with this - We can only suggest how they handle it - Arpad: Can we let them decide how the linkage is done? - Todd: Some vendors have 5 corners - Walter should give the SiSoft position on this - Bob: We can't fix this with more rules now - If the algorithm is correct C_comp is not a speed issue - Arpad: Edge rates will not change but reflections will - We could have a scheme of having parameters with "_" added - They would override the basic parameters - Bob: Vendors might have to put a selector inside their algorithms - Some have selector table spreadsheets to choose mappings - Others automatically figure out which are slow and fast - Arpad: They could give different results - Bob: We can't fix that - Radek: That has to be solved for IBIS in general, not here - Arpad: Then we have to leave it vague? - If a BIRD is in process then why not link this to it? - It will be an optional parameter - Radek: Having Format Corner will be usable - Todd: We can leave it vague and fix it later - Ken: We need another review cycle for this - Bob: We should have period after abbreviations like min and max AR: Arpad add abbreviation periods to Corner Range BIRD draft Info,Out,InOut BIRD: - Bob: The contention was over whether models could modify Model_specific parameters - Arpad: I added the words "must not" - Bob: We have tools doing different things, no portability - Todd: If that were true no one would be using AMI models - Bob: The portability is limited - Todd: The debate is about whether progress is allowed - It is a big discussion - Bob: Vendors have done non-standard things with standard IBIS - I thought the issue here had been resolved - Arpad: We are linking it with new capabilities - We can delay this BIRD until the new features are approved - Radek: We should clarify sooner - People need to no what is compliant now - Arpad: Do the words "in order to be compliant" help? - Todd: The word "compliant" is a problem - Bob: A new AMI file is needed for each EDA vendor - Todd: Not true - Radek: These things should be brought to the users' attention - Bob: Walter's email prescribes an administrative process - That is out of bounds - Arpad: We need to look at prioritization - Next meeting we can look at the task list Meeting ended. ------------- Next meeting: 28 Jun 2011 12:00pm PT Next agenda: 1) Task list item discussions ------------- IBIS Interconnect SPICE Wish List: 1) Simulator directives